Madden 23 - the impacts of your quarter length settings

[timhere1970]

Quote: Originally Posted by canes21

I don't think the clock has as much to do with it as it does the logic of the QB's under pressure. Basically any time I user a DL or send a pressure package that works, the QB is about guaranteed to play like an idiot. I am all for pressure causing the QB to make mistakes, but right now it's more common than not to see the CPU QB heave up 3-4 picks a game off their backfoot when pressured. This is on All Madden, so it isn't like I am on Pro and that's something that comes with the AI on that level.

It has seemed to me the last few years on Last generation that once you sack a QB twice they start throwing the ball as soon as you beat your block when ushering a pass rusher. They would rather throw six interceptions than get sacked again. They become paranoid.

[JoshC1977]

Quote: Originally Posted by canes21

I don't think the clock has as much to do with it as it does the logic of the QB's under pressure. Basically any time I user a DL or send a pressure package that works, the QB is about guaranteed to play like an idiot. I am all for pressure causing the QB to make mistakes, but right now it's more common than not to see the CPU QB heave up 3-4 picks a game off their backfoot when pressured. This is on All Madden, so it isn't like I am on Pro and that's something that comes with the AI on that level.

95 thresh, right?

[canes21]

Quote: Originally Posted by JoshC1977

95 thresh, right?

As of now, but the problem exists on any value I have played on in the retail version and beta.

I just completed my first game with accelerated clock off, 10 minute quarters. One game, small sample size. Prescott still ran around and threw off platform too much for my liking, but he only turned the ball over 1 time compared to the 4+ you will normally see.

What did stick out was how much more committed to the running game Dallas was. Every game I have played so far, 30+, since release with accelerated clock on, the CPU has never had less than a 2:1 pass to run ratio. This game was near a 50:50 split. That's a positive and hopefully something that will persist with accelerated clock off and isn't just a coincidence.

And for anyone who is reading this thread, but hasn't played with accelerated clock off. Even with the setting off, the game still knocks time off the clock to simulate huddling up. All accelerated clock does is make that runoff a consistent time, but with setting off the game will dynamically choose an amount of time to runoff relative to what happened on the field the play before. A 3 yard gain leads to something like 12 of the 40 seconds being ran off. A 18 yards pass leads to something like 16 seconds being ran off. So times don't get too wonky with the setting off.

[Ragnar84]

Correct me if I’m wrong but in the past the accelerated clock eliminated the CPU from making any route adjustments or audibles? Does having no accelerated clock fix that issue? Has anyone noticed any differences?


Sent from my iPad using Operation Sports

[schnaidt1]

Going to test this... Will report back.


Thank you

Quote: Originally Posted by JoshC1977

This is a more general post to serve as an FYI for all. Long story short; be cognizant of your quarter length/acc clock settings and the impacts they may have on your gameplay. (As a quick aside - these observations were made on current gen - I have no idea about old gen) Background: I had been playing around with default AP settings and was pretty consistently observing this odd CPU behavior where you would flush a QB out of the pocket and on the run, he would attempt this off-balance pass down the field. Inexplicably, it would nearly always be a wobbler that would go straight to a defender for an interception. I have NEVER seen this animation/issue before; but it was consistent and a couple of guys I know were also seeing it. Great QBs like Russell Wilson were making utterly boneheaded decisions (so bad, even a MUT player would cringe) Tried a quite few things; nothing seemed to fix it (it occurred on AM as well, but with lower frequency due to the lower number of times the CPU would be under pressure. I basically thought, it's a bug; and decided to roll with it. Well, I had run quite a few games at that point and had been running 10 min quarters with a 20 second accelerated clock. As we actually have defense in 23 (unlike in 22), the numbers were just WAY too low. So, I turned accelerated clock off to get a few more plays. Started playing and quickly realized something unexpected; that boneheaded QB behavior with the "wobblers" that went straight to defenders completely went away. Heck, the AI as a whole was playing a much more balanced and intelligent brand of football. I'll say it right here....Madden 23 Default AP on 10 min quarters with no acc clock is the best experience I've ever had with this series. Now, I was on discord with a friend and he tried out 11 min quarters with the 20 sec acc clock. He saw the same change in AI behavior (though increasing the quarter length did reduce the aggression, or the "bite" of the AI play). So basically, I think what was happening is that the AI, when running 10 min quarters with 20 sec acc clock, was perceiving it didn't "have enough time". So, nearly every play, they were "trying to make things happen". This lead to a LOT of questionable decision making by the AI. When we added more plays in the game (either by disabling the acc clock or increasing the quarter length); they "calmed down" and played with more control (and not just QBs, but across the board). Breakdown: I personally would advise not going below 10 min/no acc clock for any difficulty - that seems to be the point where things turn bad. For most people in here, that is likely not an issue. The AI is aggressive to a fault on shorter games and it can definitely cause issues. If you're on All Pro or Pro, I would also highly suggest you take a good long look at just sticking to 10 min/no acc clock (where I personally see a good solid 120 plays per game). This seems to be the optimal setting to get the best performance out of the CPU - higher clock settings can quickly put you in the boat of feeling like you only lose if you beat yourself (vs feeling like the AI can beat you) - a common complaint for many here. AM players can likely manage higher quarter lengths; indeed, it might be beneficial in quieting-down some of the over-the-top issues. Final thoughts: Long story short: this is a cautionary post, not "the gospel" or anything like that. I'm sharing these observations as most are in the nascent stages of slider development. I strongly suggest you consider the impact of your preferred quarter length/clock setting and give different settings a shot BEFORE adjusting anything. You might be pleasantly surprised. I also suggest that as you guys fine-tune things; you lock-in your quarter length/acc clock setting (and bypassing the 'personal preference 'trope) - and when you get the inevitable whiner asking if they can use "X clock setting", tell them it is at their own risk. Well, that's it, I'm off...have a good slider cycle guys...

[canes21]

Quote: Originally Posted by Ragnar84

Correct me if I’m wrong but in the past the accelerated clock eliminated the CPU from making any route adjustments or audibles? Does having no accelerated clock fix that issue? Has anyone noticed any differences? Sent from my iPad using Operation Sports

In the past, if you kept the accelerated clock at 20 seconds or 25 seconds, they'd make these adjustments. Anything under 20 and they never did.

So far in my experience with the retail version, 30+ games all, but the last with accelerated clock at 20 seconds, I have not seen a single adjustment pre-snap by the CPU.

I will continue to play games with the accelerated clock off and will be sure to make note if they do make any adjustments. So far in the one game I played with it off they did not make an adjustment, but one game is not a big enough sample size to say what they will and will not do for certain.

[itbeme23]

Quote: Originally Posted by canes21

What did stick out was how much more committed to the running game Dallas was. Every game I have played so far, 30+, since release with accelerated clock on, the CPU has never had less than a 2:1 pass to run ratio. This game was near a 50:50 split. That's a positive and hopefully something that will persist with accelerated clock off and isn't just a coincidence.

This would be a game changer for me, personally. I've become obsessed with playbooks (specifically run/pass ratios) over the past three Madden cycles (and sprinkle some NFL 2K5 in there as well), and I've done some pretty extensive research and playbook editing/modding on PC. This is the first year I've come back to console Madden in 5+ years, and while I love the next gen gameplay and visuals on my Series X, the CPU playcalling has been atrocious. I've created three team-specific custom playbooks in M23 (based on 2021 NFL run/pass data), and it's been a mixed bag.

The issue with Madden playbooks is there are twice (sometimes 3x) as many pass plays as there are run plays (when using the complete playbook). As such, the AI is naturally going to be inclined to call pass plays more often. I've been editing playbooks in-game, but it's significantly limited compared to the modding tools available for PC. I'm not completely certain that the star rating system is accurate enough to influence the on-field AI playcalling.

HOWEVER, if the combination of custom playbooks AND the 10 minute quarter/no accelerated clock fixes the CPU playcalling, then it'd bring a whole new level of realism to the experience (for me).

To bring it back to what Josh originally posted about how quarter lengths and accelerated clock setting affect other areas of the game...

This is especially true for fatigue and auto-sub settings (which has been my other Madden obsession for years). It's been a few years since I tested this (probably the last time I played Madden on console), but I found that the dreaded "disappearing player" bug usually occurred when the fatigue setting was too high in relation to the quarter/accelerated clock setting. If there is any credence to Josh's observations (which I have full confidence in), then I imagine the same would still be true regarding fatigue and auto subs.

Up to this point, I've been playing with 13 minute quarters with a 75 fatiuge setting, and I still haven't found the right auto sub settings that leads to consistent subbing on the field (in Play Now, anyway).

This is a really great find, Josh!

[Momoney168]

Quote: Originally Posted by Ragnar84

Correct me if I’m wrong but in the past the accelerated clock eliminated the CPU from making any route adjustments or audibles? Does having no accelerated clock fix that issue? Has anyone noticed any differences? Sent from my iPad using Operation Sports

I play on AM - 25 sec acc and I see audible depending on who the QB is. But I’m gonna test with no acc and see if I can spot anything different.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports