Playbooks Play-Type Assignments They should add

[vannwolfhawk]

Quote: Originally Posted by Da_Czar

Okay. The separation of play types is a separate issue. I am hopeful that can be done. Not sure how many but on the other thing in the past the question was do you want the play types weighted if so we had a limit on them. And I believe that info was put out there somewhere I think in my play call essentials video or the 2k blog or someplace if not you should have asked me . LOL Right now it seems to be split some want more play-types assigned to each player. Some prefer to have them weighted. I don't know how great it would be if you had 8 playtypes but you had no control over how often one was ran over the other. I think that would make it ever more difficult to get them to play how you want or limit the play types you assign anyway because you don't want a pick /roll pg running mid range or handoffs just as much or more than the pick and rolls. So I am thinking having more play-types without weight wouldn't give you the benefit your looking for because the more play types you add the more random his play will be (for cpu ai) as he cycles though all 8 play types with no weight. IMO of course I will recommend whatever you guys want tho. Edit... Nope I was right in the play calling dev diary it has this In NBA 2K12, any player in the game can be assigned as many as four different play types. These four playtypes are ranked 1-4 and weighted accordingly, so those who choose auto playcalling can influence which types of plays are called more often. So it is not 2k's fault this time. And I also put it in my video on play calling essentials @ the 1:25 mark

Gotcha!

I knew that they weighted the play types. I guess what I was asking is and was are the individual plays weighted as well within the playbook? Meaning this - If I have mid range play call for Ray Allen at the number 1 play type for him will he call the 1st play in the Celtics playbook that falls into this play type more so than the last mid range shot at the bottom of the playbook? Are those plays weighted as well? If so then we kind of already have the weighted system and the playbooks just need to be tweaked and moved around to get the top plays per team that they run at the top of their playbooks.

Make sense? Good video though. I forgot about that one... Good stuff... I dont know why anyone would use auto play calling though?! LOL!

[bigeastbumrush]

Quote: Originally Posted by iLLosophy

Honestly Czar, I'd rather see it broken out by Play Set than Play type. Motion, Hawk, Horns, box, Triangle, etc. Categorizing plays by PnR, Midrange, Cutter is ok if that's the ONLY thing going on, but a lot of the plays have multiple things going on. The NJN PnP 51 play could fall into Cutter, Low Post, Pick n Roll, 3pt, Midrange depending on how you use it. Even though the post player is a small part of that play, if my post player doesn't have Low Post (i think that's what it's categorized under) selected, I can't use that play. That doesn't make any sense. You should separate the single option plays and maybe incorporate those into the quick play menu, but the rest of the plays that have multiple options should be sorted by Play set, not by player.

Whattup Czar.

I didn't read through the entire thread but I agree with the bolded from iLL.

I don't want this (and video bball as a whole) to turn into NBA Live 05 where players seem to be running through some mo-capped "synchronized swimming" motions every time down the court.

Hope we're not complicating things beyond a fun experience here. We love sim but let's not lose the fun.

[vannwolfhawk]

Quote: Originally Posted by balldoktor81

IMO you should see the categories(Isolation/Mid/Cutter etc.) when the plays-box pops up so even timmy would realize what he is gonna about to do next LOL!

See I like this idea. Push LB, pick player you want to call play for, play types pop up, pick mid range, then only mid range comes up, pick play and VOILA! I know Czar disagrees with me here but we are only adding 1 button press. I know 2k doesn't want to add anything that might or will complicate things, but IMO this will uncomplicate it. It makes "Timmy" understand what he is calling rather than looking at 32 different plays in 7 pages of confusion? As of now he just picks a play and prays its a mid range play. LOL! He has no idea what play he is calling because like you said earlier he doesn't know the play names or play types...

[youALREADYknow]

Quote: Originally Posted by iLLosophy

Honestly Czar, I'd rather see it broken out by Play Set than Play type. Motion, Hawk, Horns, box, Triangle, etc. Categorizing plays by PnR, Midrange, Cutter is ok if that's the ONLY thing going on, but a lot of the plays have multiple things going on.

I'd love if that happened. That's a coach specific categorization though and not player specific. Coaching dictates scheme which dictates sets. Players just fill roles within those sets. We shouldn't be able to force player personnel to dictate that a D'Antoni team suddenly runs the Triangle offense just because 2011 Kobe got traded to the Knicks for example. In real life, Kobe now runs Mike Brown's system whether he likes it or not. His play type hasn't changed but the design of the plays has.

The Play Set options should be in the Coach Profiles IMO and there would be no reason to hide that from us since "Timmy" doesn't ever look at Coach Profiles anyways. I think that more of play calling needs to be tied into Coach Profiles instead of the Player Edit screen.

[iLLosophy]

Quote: Originally Posted by youALREADYknow

I'd love if that happened. That's a coach specific categorization though and not player specific. Coaching dictates scheme which dictates sets. Players just fill roles within those sets. We shouldn't be able to force player personnel to dictate that a D'Antoni team suddenly runs the Triangle offense just because 2011 Kobe got traded to the Knicks for example. In real life, Kobe now runs Mike Brown's system whether he likes it or not. His play type hasn't changed but the design of the plays has. The Play Set options should be in the Coach Profiles IMO and there would be no reason to hide that from us since "Timmy" doesn't ever look at Coach Profiles anyways. I think that more of play calling needs to be tied into Coach Profiles instead of the Player Edit screen.

So a default playset (i.e. Triangle) per coaching profile, but still have the option to any player specific plays? And if you don't specify, the game by default pick from plays in that playset? I realize my idea is drastic, but even this would be a good start for next year.

[youALREADYknow]

Quote: Originally Posted by iLLosophy

So a default playset (i.e. Triangle) per coaching profile, but still have the option to any player specific plays? And if you don't specify, the game by default pick from plays in that playset? I realize my idea is drastic, but even this would be a good start for next year.

This is all theoretical, but here goes...

Each play "object" would have the following properties:
Playbook: Wizards
Play Name: WAS Horns 3 Roll
Play Type: Pick & Roll
Play Set: Horns
Target 1: SF/3 (P&R Ball Handler)
Target 2: C/5 (P&R Roll Man)

If there was a default play set of Horns within the Coach Profile for this team, then this play would get an increase in ranking/weighting over a Triangle play within the same playbook.

If the SF on this team has P&R Ball Handler as their #1 Play Type and the Coach has Horns as their default Play Set, then this play would likely be their top ranked play.

If the C on the team has P&R Roll Man as their #1 Play Type, then this would rank very high on their list as well.

I don't think that level of detail makes it any harder for the casual gamer who will only look at plays in-game, practice mode, or glancing through the playbooks.

The code-behind would be doing the weighting by taking into account the Play Type ranking and the Play Set in the Coach Profile.

[Da_Czar]

Quote: Originally Posted by vannwolfhawk

See I like this idea. Push LB, pick player you want to call play for, play types pop up, pick mid range, then only mid range comes up, pick play and VOILA! I know Czar disagrees with me here but we are only adding 1 button press. I know 2k doesn't want to add anything that might or will complicate things, but IMO this will uncomplicate it. It makes "Timmy" understand what he is calling rather than looking at 32 different plays in 7 pages of confusion? As of now he just picks a play and prays its a mid range play. LOL! He has no idea what play he is calling because like you said earlier he doesn't know the play names or play types...

I only have a 3rd party disagreement with you vann. I suggested that last year but they felt like adding another button in the mix would give it too many finger gymnastics for a 24 second shot clock.

Some of my objections are because I know what they are going to say because they have said it. LOL I had a great argument going to.

If we could find a way to make it optional we might have something. Where it works like regular but if you hit a switch in the menu your saying bring on the extra button press. I am a professional LOL

[Da_Czar]

Quote: Originally Posted by youALREADYknow

I'd love if that happened. That's a coach specific categorization though and not player specific. Coaching dictates scheme which dictates sets. Players just fill roles within those sets. We shouldn't be able to force player personnel to dictate that a D'Antoni team suddenly runs the Triangle offense just because 2011 Kobe got traded to the Knicks for example. In real life, Kobe now runs Mike Brown's system whether he likes it or not. His play type hasn't changed but the design of the plays has. The Play Set options should be in the Coach Profiles IMO and there would be no reason to hide that from us since "Timmy" doesn't ever look at Coach Profiles anyways. I think that more of play calling needs to be tied into Coach Profiles instead of the Player Edit screen.

I thought they got to some of that this year with the play-types if you trade Kobe the triangle doesn't move with him. But he would inherit the plays for those playtypes in the new coaches playbook.

True also timmy has no business in the coach profile screen...

I see some genius in the idea just not sure how to bring it out yet.