"High level fighter" vs. Pedestrian fighter

[Evil97]

Quote: Originally Posted by Solid_Altair

EA MMA's system was great for its time and might have been the most intuitive. It didn't really have a good composition for a competitive level, though. The triangle was pretty much the only viable submission in the game.

Limb submissions were very viable. You just had to hold down the bumpers. Little subtle trick that wasn't intended.

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[tomitomitomi]

Quote: Originally Posted by MacAttack33

Here, let me give you a hint. It’s often used in the context of damage, stamina and less often for the s*** mini game we have for the ground game.

Was this "hint" supposed to be helpful in any way? You're still gonna call whatever you dislike unrealistic.

[TheGentlemanGhost]

Winning is more about just knowing the system and it’s little “secrets” than it is anything else. A lot of competitive guys like this but it takes any organic feeling of such an unpredictable sport completely away.

It feels like the devs worked so hard to try and make sure everything had some kind of counter, they forgot how the sport and certain situations really work. It doesn’t help that a lot of these measures are more rooted in video game logic than realism.

And as far as the sub talk goes, of course I love EA MMAs subs in over this one. Loved it! It’s the main reason I still pop in the game. Subs can happen for just a couple seconds or a minute since there’s nothing like timed gates that last for 4 seconds a piece. Plus stamina being a factor while performing subs and using that stamina to basically apply pressure was great as well.


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[iHazCode]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

No I wasnt because OS was pretty much offline only back then. No one here gave a **** about "high level players." We didnt know who the top online players in UD3 were because the focus was on offline. That "High Level Player" stuff is an online issue. Thats why I try to balance the line of informing this community what many high level players are arguing vs. not really giving a ****. I'm an offline player. I have sliders. I'm hoping to have more sliders and the ability to edit fighters stats in the next game. The next game will have even more improvements to AI. With all of that stuff, I can make the game what ever I want. If I get that, I dont care what the meta is. I dont care whats OP. I dont care who is spamming what. Those are online problems. Now to answer your question: Without even finding proof, I'm confident in agreeing that you didnt hear the "high level players will be upset" argument as much with UD3. With that said, its not for the reasons you may think. 1) I dont recall the comp community being that big when it came to UD3 as it is with EA UFC. It was 7 years. More people have broadband. Consoles are better. Internet is better. The first MMA game that really pushed that community was EA MMA. THQ created the game with an offline focus. I'm not saying that the online community wasnt active or didnt exist. I'm just saying that it seems bigger now. 2) Sim players had similar issues with ranked online back in 2012. Stamina and aggression were still issues back then just like they are now. Remember sim stamina wasnt in ranked. The difference was that if a sim player hated ranked, they could play unranked with sim stamina or just play offline. Now only one of those is an option.

Wow, I'm slow , when you kept saying Offline I thought you were referring to some kind of Offline Forum (which I thought was odd) but yeah that totally makes sense. What we are seeing are "online" problems and not truly gameplay mechanic problems (not that there are none).

With that on the table, I somewhat in a way wish they would have spent the first 6 years creating a solid MMA foundation then open up the floodgates for online in some ways. Considering about 60% of their development cycle is probably dedicated to tuning things for the online community which most likely isn't directly improving the mechanics of the sim/game but instead finding things to dampen symptoms as they come up and/or people are vocal about them.

That said, yeah the whole online vs. offline thing does give me a new perspective on what sets this franchise apart from the Undisputed franchise for example, where in some regards I feel they made much more progress on the fundamentals of the sport this somewhat helps me better reason about how/why that could be.

[Solid_Altair]

Quote: Originally Posted by MacAttack33

EA MMA is the only one I never played. I may have to give that one a go sometime since people talk about it so much. A lot of it is nostalgia I'm sure though.

Though this might be just a first person bias, I really think I was one of the people who enjoyed the game the most, without nostalgia.

Back in the days before UFC 3, I recommend you checking it out, for the damage system. After UFC 3, though, only the submissions would stand out, and not really for being better; just for being more intuitive.

Quote: Originally Posted by Evil97

Limb submissions were very viable. You just had to hold down the bumpers. Little subtle trick that wasn't intended.

I had no idea. That sounds like a bug, though. Good thing it wasn't widespread. I actually liked limb submissions, even though they weren't nearly as dangerous as chokes (especially the triangle, for being easy to set up).

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by iHazCode

Wow, I'm slow , when you kept saying Offline I thought you were referring to some kind of Offline Forum (which I thought was odd) but yeah that totally makes sense. What we are seeing are "online" problems and not truly gameplay mechanic problems (not that there are none). With that on the table, I somewhat in a way wish they would have spent the first 6 years creating a solid MMA foundation then open up the floodgates for online in some ways. Considering about 60% of their development cycle is probably dedicated to tuning things for the online community which most likely isn't directly improving the mechanics of the sim/game but instead finding things to dampen symptoms as they come up and/or people are vocal about them. That said, yeah the whole online vs. offline thing does give me a new perspective on what sets this franchise apart from the Undisputed franchise for example, where in some regards I feel they made much more progress on the fundamentals of the sport this somewhat helps me better reason about how/why that could be.

That would be nice but it isnt realistic. Every sports game created now focuses on the online community and online growth.

Also, 60% of development time isnt for tuning things for the online community. In fact, most of the development time is used for things that either affects both communities or just offline. Now when it comes to patches...yeah most of those are based on online feedback but there is a reason for that.

Online players provide more feedback. Even at OS, we have an active dev who handles AI and is regularly in contact with the forums. Even with that, only 5-10 people regularly give offline/AI feedback. The majority of people here who are consistantly talking about realism and sim play are online players (some ranked/some not).

[1212headkick]

Some things are completely out of our control (conor able to throw 200 strikes a round if "lands" on the block and the horrible head movement and body shots)

While others are a direct fault of the player (not making reads, not managing head health, not looking for other areas to steer the fight like clinch or ground.)

Things that would make the game better would be a neutral stance, v step, more stopping power on STATIONARY jabs, less ga conceded when striking an opponent on the ground (should scale if you spam shots). Watch ten of your losses with humility and it will drastically benefit you. Youll find your bad habits.